EXHIBIT 4: [PROPOSED] EXHIBITS TO
SUPPLEMENTAL DECLARATION OF JOEL FLEMING

Case 2:10-cv-09198-JVS -RNB Document 346-4 Filed 10/02/12 Page 1 of 19 Page ID
#:15283

EXHIBIT A

Case 2:10-cv-09198-JVS -RNB Document 346-4 Filed 10/02/12 Page 2 of 19 Page ID
#:15284

1
UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT
CENTRAL DISTRICT OF CALIFORNIA
2
SOUTHERN DIVISION
3
_______________________________
4
)
JOYCE WALKER, KIM BRUCE )
5
HOWLETT, and MURIEL SPOONER, )
on behalf of themselves and )
6
all others similarly situated, )
)
7
Plaintiffs, )
)
8
vs. ) No. CV 10-9198-JVS (RNBx)
)
9
LIFE INSURANCE COMPANY OF )
THE SOUTHWEST, a Texas )
10
corporation, and DOES 1-50, )
)
11
Defendants. )
)
12
_______________________________)
13
14
15
DEPOSITION OF JOYCE WALKER
16
San Francisco, California
17
Friday, January 27, 2012
18
Volume I
19
20
21
Reported by:
GINA GLANTZ
22
CSR No. 9795, RPR, RMR
23
JOB No. 131931
24
25
PAGES 1 - 244

Page 1

Sarnoff, A VERITEXT COMPANY
877-955-3855

Case 2:10-cv-09198-JVS -RNB Document 346-4 Filed 10/02/12 Page 3 of 19 Page ID
#:15285

1
we up to?

2
THE REPORTER: 19.

3
(Walker Exhibit 19 was marked.)

4
MR. SHAPIRO: Maybe the court reporter can just

5
mark the one that Charlie -- if you wouldn't mind.

6
MR. FREIBERG: That's 20.

7
THE REPORTER: I don't have a 20 yet.

8
BY MR. SHAPIRO:

9
Q The court reporter has handed you a document which

10
has been marked as Walker Exhibit 19, and it bears a Bates

11
number JW000678. Do you recognize your signature at the

12
bottom of that?

13
A Yes, I do.

14
Q And the date next to that?

15
A 1/11/08.

16
Q On January 11th, 2008, did you sign your name

17
acknowledging your receipt of your life insurance policy,

18
a life insurance buyer's guide, an IUL buyer's guide and a

19
proposal which matches the policy you received?

20
A I did sign this on that date.

21
Q Did you get each of those documents that are

22
referenced in the one sentence above which you signed?

23
A I received the policy, the buyer's guide, but not

24
an illustration.

25
Q Okay. Just so we're clear, you received the

Page 205

Sarnoff, A VERITEXT COMPANY
877-955-3855

Case 2:10-cv-09198-JVS -RNB Document 346-4 Filed 10/02/12 Page 4 of 19 Page ID
#:15286

1
policy, the life insurance buyer's guide, and also the IUL

2
buyer's guide?

3
A I don't know what the IUL buyer's guide is, so I

4
don't know what that is.

5
Q Okay. Well, fair to say, on January 11th, 2008,

6
you certified with your signature that you received those

7
first three things, correct, the policy, the life

8
insurance buyer's guide and the IUL buyer's guide?

9
A It says "if applicable" and I don't know if it was

10
applicable.

11
Q Okay. So you read "if applicable" applying to the

12
IUL buyer's guide?

13
A Correct.

14
Q Okay. Let's take the first one, the policy. Did

15
you get a copy of your life insurance policy?

16
A I did.

17
Q Did you read it?

18
A I did not. I assumed that the illustration from

19
October 3rd would be a fair and accurate description --

20
depiction of the policy.

21
Q Okay. So just so we're clear, on this date,

22
January 11, 2008, you handed over a check for $112,000?

23
A That is correct.

24
Q And you handed over a check for $112,000 for a

25
life insurance policy; correct?

Page 206

Sarnoff, A VERITEXT COMPANY
877-955-3855

Case 2:10-cv-09198-JVS -RNB Document 346-4 Filed 10/02/12 Page 5 of 19 Page ID
#:15287

1
MR. FREIBERG: Objection. Argumentative.

2
THE WITNESS: I handed over a check for a

3
retirement vehicle that I believed would perform as in the

4
illustration.

5
BY MR. SHAPIRO:

6
Q Okay. And --

7
A I mean --

8
Q You were handed --

9
A I'm sorry.

10
Q No, keep going.

11
A At this juncture, where I'm sending -- handing

12
over a check and the policy is coming from Mr. Botkin and

13
Mr. Stemler, my buying decision had already been made.

14
Q Okay. So in the same meeting, you handed this

15
gentleman a check for $112,000, right, and you got, in

16
return, a bunch of documents, one of which was something

17
called a life insurance policy that you purchased; right?

18
A Yes.

19
Q Did you have an opportunity to read that life

20
insurance policy if you wanted to?

21
A Not at that time, I did not.

22
Q Did you take it home with you that night?

23
A I left a few minutes after this very short meeting

24
to go to Los Angeles to work for the better part of the

25
next few weeks, and I did not take it with me.

Page 207

Sarnoff, A VERITEXT COMPANY
877-955-3855

Case 2:10-cv-09198-JVS -RNB Document 346-4 Filed 10/02/12 Page 6 of 19 Page ID
#:15288

1
Q Okay. So your schedule was busy, so you decided

2
not to read the life insurance policy?

3
A I decided not to read it because I assumed that

4
the October 3rd illustration, which had been used

5
extensively in the explanation of the policy, was a fair

6
and accurate depiction of the policy.

7
Q Have you ever read the life insurance policy?

8
A I read parts of it while preparing for the --

9
writing the letter to Brenda, and have read parts of it in

10
preparing for the deposition.

11
Q Did anyone prevent you from reading that life

12
insurance policy, ma'am?

13
A No.

14
Q Was that your decision?

15
A It was my decision, based on the time that -- the

16
illustration was a depiction, a fair and accurate and

17
complete depiction, of the policy.

18
Q As you sit here today, do you think it was a good

19
idea not to read the life insurance policy?

20
A I can't say.

21
Q Today, if you were to buy a product that's called

22
the life insurance policy, and hand over a check for

23
$112,000, would you read it?

24
MR. FREIBERG: Objection. Incomplete and improper

25
hypothetical.

Page 208

Sarnoff, A VERITEXT COMPANY
877-955-3855

Case 2:10-cv-09198-JVS -RNB Document 346-4 Filed 10/02/12 Page 7 of 19 Page ID
#:15289

1
THE WITNESS: I don't know what I would do.

2
BY MR. SHAPIRO:

3
Q Okay. Did you read the life insurance buyer's

4
guide?

5
A I did not.

6
Q Was that your decision?

7
A Yes.

8
Q Fair to say if you don't know if you actually

9
received an IUL buyer's guide, you don't know if you

10
actually read an IUL buyer's guide?

11
A Correct, I don't know what IUL stands for. If you

12
know, that could clarify for me if I -- if it's a document

13
that I received.

14
Q You signed a certification acknowledging receipt

15
of a number of items, if applicable, and you don't know

16
what one of those items mean?

17
MR. FREIBERG: Objection. Argumentative, asked

18
and answered.

19
THE WITNESS: That's correct. It looks as if this

20
statement says "if applicable."

21
BY MR. SHAPIRO:

22
Q Okay. You just don't know --

23
A Which could mean --

24
Q -- if you got it or not?

25
A Which could mean that that was not applicable or

Page 209

Sarnoff, A VERITEXT COMPANY
877-955-3855

Case 2:10-cv-09198-JVS -RNB Document 346-4 Filed 10/02/12 Page 8 of 19 Page ID
#:15290

1
that one or the other was applicable. I can't -- I don't

2
know at this point which one the "if applicable" refers

3
to.

4
Q Did you receive a proposal "which matches the

5
policy I received"?

6
A I did not.

7
Q Okay. So that part of your acknowledging receipt

8
is just simply false?

9
A I signed an illustration, but did not receive a

10
copy of that illustration.

11
Q I'm just looking at this exhibit, which is Walker

12
Exhibit No. 19, and there's something called an owner's

13
signature. It's your signature, and you're signing one

14
sentence in which you're acknowledging receipt of some

15
documents. The last document you're acknowledging receipt

16
of is something called a proposal, which matches the

17
policy you received; right?

18
A Um-hmm, yes.

19
Q Okay. Is this a true acknowledgment that you

20
signed?

21
MR. FREIBERG: Objection. Asked and answered,

22
argumentative.

23
THE WITNESS: What I believe occurred is that I

24
had an illustration placed in front of me, was signed, but

25
was not left with me, and possibly, I was told, that I

Page 210

Sarnoff, A VERITEXT COMPANY
877-955-3855

Case 2:10-cv-09198-JVS -RNB Document 346-4 Filed 10/02/12 Page 9 of 19 Page ID
#:15291

EXHIBIT B

Case 2:10-cv-09198-JVS -RNB Document 346-4 Filed 10/02/12 Page 10 of 19 Page ID
#:15292

194
UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT
CENTRAL DISTRICT OF CALIFORNIA
SOUTHERN DIVISION
--oOo--
JOYCE WALKER, KIM BRUCE
HOWLETT, and MURIEL SPOONER,
on behalf of themselves and all others
similarly situated,

Plaintiffs,

vs. Case No. CV-10-9198-JVS

LIFE INSURANCE COMPANY OF
THE SOUTHWEST, a Texas
corporation, and DOES 1-50,

Defendants.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

DEPOSITION OF
KIM BRUCE HOWLETT
Thursday, May 10, 2012
VOLUME II
(Pages 194 - 289)
2:10 P.M.
101 California Street
23rd Floor
San Francisco, California

Corey W. Anderson, CSR 4096

KIM BRUCE HOWLETT - Volume II
May 10, 2012

Toll Free: 800.211.DEPO
Facsimile: 415.591.3335

Suite 1100
44 Montgomery Street
San Francisco, CA 94104
www.esquiresolutions.com

Case 2:10-cv-09198-JVS -RNB Document 346-4 Filed 10/02/12 Page 11 of 19 Page ID
#:15293

219

1
you buy a policy?

2
MR. FREIBERG: Objection. Argumentative.

3
THE WITNESS: I bought a policy based on

4
the July 27th illustration.

5
BY MR. SHAPIRO:

6
Q. Did you ever read the policy you

7
purchased?

8
A. I have not read the policy.

9
Q. Ever in your life?

10
A. I have read a portion.

11
Q. When?

12
A. As part of information that was compiled

13
by my legal team.

14
Q. Before or after you sued?

15
A. After.

16
Q. So it's your testimony that you bought an

17
insurance policy, but never read it until after you

18
filed a class action lawsuit based on the policy?

19
A. I purchased a policy based on the July

20
27th illustration.

21
Q. Did you --

22
MR. FREIBERG: Wait.

23
THE WITNESS: I did not -- and I did not

24
read it subsequently, subsequent to purchase.

25
BY MR. SHAPIRO:

KIM BRUCE HOWLETT - Volume II
May 10, 2012

Toll Free: 800.211.DEPO
Facsimile: 415.591.3335

Suite 1100
44 Montgomery Street
San Francisco, CA 94104
www.esquiresolutions.com

Case 2:10-cv-09198-JVS -RNB Document 346-4 Filed 10/02/12 Page 12 of 19 Page ID
#:15294

220

1
Q. Did you have a chance to read your

2
insurance policy?

3
A. Yes.

4
Q. Was it your decision not to?

5
A. Yes.

6
Q. And you take responsibility for that

7
decision as well, sir.

8
Right?

9
MR. FREIBERG: Objection, vague and

10
ambiguous.

11
THE WITNESS: Yes.

12
BY MR. SHAPIRO:

13
Q. And notwithstanding your counsel's

14
objection, you understand what it means to take

15
responsibility for something.

16
Right?

17
MR. FREIBERG: Objection, vague and

18
ambiguous.

19
THE WITNESS: I think it depends on the

20
context as to what you mean by responsibility.

21
BY MR. SHAPIRO:

22
Q. Are you responsible for the honesty of the

23
court papers that are put in front of the federal

24
court with your name on it?

25
MR. FREIBERG: Objection, vague,

KIM BRUCE HOWLETT - Volume II
May 10, 2012

Toll Free: 800.211.DEPO
Facsimile: 415.591.3335

Suite 1100
44 Montgomery Street
San Francisco, CA 94104
www.esquiresolutions.com

Case 2:10-cv-09198-JVS -RNB Document 346-4 Filed 10/02/12 Page 13 of 19 Page ID
#:15295

EXHIBIT C

Case 2:10-cv-09198-JVS -RNB Document 346-4 Filed 10/02/12 Page 14 of 19 Page ID
#:15296

Page 1

·1

·2· · · · · · · · UNITED STATES DISCTRICT COURT

·3· · · · · · · · CENTRAL DISTRICT OF CALIFORNIA

·4

·5· ·JOYCE WALKER, KIM BRUCE HOWLETT,
· · ·and MURIEL SPOONER, on behalf
·6· ·of themselves and all others
· · ·similarly situated,
·7

·8· · · · · · · · · · · Plaintiffs,

·9· · · · · · ·v.· · · · · · · · · · ·CASE NO.:
· · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · · 10-9198JVS(RNBx)
10· ·LIFE INSURANCE COMPANY OF THE
· · ·SOUTHWEST, a Texas corporation,
11

12· · · · · · · · · · · ·Defendant.

13· · · · ·˜˜˜˜˜˜˜˜˜˜˜˜˜˜˜˜˜˜˜˜˜˜˜˜˜˜˜˜˜˜˜˜˜˜˜˜

14· · · · · · · · · · · · ·CONFIDENTIAL

15· · · · · · · · · VIDEOTAPED DEPOSITION OF

16· · · · · · · · · · · MURIEL L. SPOONER

17

18· · · · · · · · · · · · ·June 29, 2012

19· · · · · · · · · · · · · 9:10 a.m.

20

21· · · · · ·Kasowitz, Benson, Torres & Friedman LLP

22· · · · · · · 101 California Street, Suite 2300

23· · · · · · · ·San Francisco, California 94111

24

25· · · · · ·Reported by Mary Goff - CSR
· · · · · · ·California Certificate No. 13427

MURIEL L. SPOONER·
WALKER vs. LIFE INS. CO. OF THE S.W.
June 29, 2012

800.211.DEPO (3376)
EsquireSolutions.com

MURIEL L. SPOONER·
WALKER vs. LIFE INS. CO. OF THE S.W.
June 29, 2012
Confidential

800.211.DEPO (3376)
EsquireSolutions.com

Case 2:10-cv-09198-JVS -RNB Document 346-4 Filed 10/02/12 Page 15 of 19 Page ID
#:15297

Page 156

·1· ·to read your insurance policy carefully?

·2· · · · · · ·MR. FREIBERG:· Objection; vague and ambiguous.

·3· · · · A· · They -- had -- had they had this on the list

·4· ·of important things to consider.· So yeah, you know, it

·5· ·would be something you would consider doing.

·6· · · · Q· · (BY MR. SHAPIRO) Did you read your policy

·7· ·carefully, as stated by the National Association of

·8· ·Insurance Commissioners?

·9· · · · A· · No.

10· · · · Q· · Did you read your policy at all?

11· · · · A· · Not after just receiving it, no.

12· · · · Q· · Have you ever in your life read your insurance

13· ·policy?

14· · · · A· · I have read through it now.

15· · · · Q· · When was the first time you read your

16· ·insurance policy?

17· · · · A· · Again, reading through it when we went through

18· ·it with our -- with Jack Dugan.

19· · · · Q· · So what, more than a year after you purchased

20· ·it?

21· · · · A· · Approximately, yes.

22· · · · Q· · Any reason why you couldn't have read the

23· ·insurance policy when it was provided to you and you

24· ·acknowledged receiving it in October of 2007?

25· · · · A· · No.· There would be no reason.

MURIEL L. SPOONER·
WALKER vs. LIFE INS. CO. OF THE S.W.
June 29, 2012

800.211.DEPO (3376)
EsquireSolutions.com

MURIEL L. SPOONER·
WALKER vs. LIFE INS. CO. OF THE S.W.
June 29, 2012
Confidential

800.211.DEPO (3376)
EsquireSolutions.com

YVer1f

Case 2:10-cv-09198-JVS -RNB Document 346-4 Filed 10/02/12 Page 16 of 19 Page ID
#:15298

Page 232

·1· · · · A· · Yes.

·2· · · · Q· · And that was the same evening meeting in which

·3· ·you and your husband reviewed for the first time the

·4· ·July 27 illustration, correct?

·5· · · · A· · Yes, that is correct.

·6· · · · Q· · Sequentially in that meeting, which did you do

·7· ·first, dictate your application or review the

·8· ·illustration?

·9· · · · A· · I don't recall the order.

10· · · · Q· · Okay.· Do you remember -- strike that.

11· · · · · · ·Were you also in Mr. Cooper's office on

12· ·October 11, 2007, when he reviewed with you the as

13· ·issued illustration --

14· · · · · · ·MR. FREIBERG:· Objection.

15· · · · Q· · (BY MR. SHAPIRO) -- Spooner Exhibit 12?

16· · · · · · ·MR. FREIBERG:· Objection; misstates the

17· ·testimony of the witness.

18· · · · A· · As I recall, we met in his office to receive

19· ·this.

20· · · · Q· · (BY MR. SHAPIRO) Were you in a conference room

21· ·or in his office?

22· · · · A· · To my best recollection, it was his office.

23· · · · Q· · Husband was there, right?

24· · · · A· · Yes, that's correct.

25· · · · Q· · Anyone else in the room?

MURIEL L. SPOONER·
WALKER vs. LIFE INS. CO. OF THE S.W.
June 29, 2012

800.211.DEPO (3376)
EsquireSolutions.com

MURIEL L. SPOONER·
WALKER vs. LIFE INS. CO. OF THE S.W.
June 29, 2012
Confidential

800.211.DEPO (3376)
EsquireSolutions.com

YVer1f

Case 2:10-cv-09198-JVS -RNB Document 346-4 Filed 10/02/12 Page 17 of 19 Page ID
#:15299

EXHIBIT D

Case 2:10-cv-09198-JVS -RNB Document 346-4 Filed 10/02/12 Page 18 of 19 Page ID
#:15300

Confidential

Polic' Cost mid Benefit Siumnaty
Prepared for
JOYCE ANN SCHMIDTBAUERLSOI566I000-UDA 3H14
Presentad by JEFFREY SThMLER

$2.464.759 LSW Provider with benets previoIy described.

Guaranteed
Guaranteed
Guaranteed Current Basis B Current Basis B Cuitent Basis B
Policy
Annual EndYear Net EndYearNet
Annual
End YcarNet
En&Year Net
Year
CashFlow
Cashvalue DeathBeneflt
Cash Flow
Cash Value5
Deathfleneflt

Averaged
Avenged Averaged Net
Policy
Annual
Net Equity Death Benefit
Year
Cash Flow5
End Year5
End Year*

5
$ (112.637) $
488,472
$ 2,464.759

10
0
567,822
2,464,759

20
(48,198)
1.230,285
2,464,759
(I-)

23
(48,198)
1,543,496
2,464,759

U)
t)
5ßenpflls and values are not guaranteed. The assumptions on which they are based are subject to changØy the"
insurer. Attuai results may be mote or leas favorable.

I have received a copy of this illuscratlon mid understand that any non-guarthtteed elements illustralad are snbjec
change and could be either higher or lower. The agent hua told me they are nut guaqmtoed. I UNDERSTAND TRAT
HISTORICAL PERFORMANCE OF THE SSc? 500 INDEX SHOULD NOT BE CONSIDERED A
REPRESENTATION OF THE PAST OR FUTURE PERFORMANCE VOR ANY OF THE INDEXED
STRATEOmS IN TUE POLICY.

Date
/O
Applicant By
JOYCE ANN SCHMIDTBAUE1t
I cex1il3 that this illustration bas been presented to the applicant and thai I have explained that any non-guaranteed
elements Waned are subject to change. I have made no statements
iare
onsistent with the Illustration.

Date//Il/ak

LIFE mzsuRMIcs COMPANY or WE SOUTHWEST, DALLAS, IX 75247-4921
Decznber 27, 2007
This illustration is not complete without all pages.
Pago 23o1 23
TC37133(1007)
Y73

4)
',4tU

EXHIBIT NO .2- ¿)

DATE
-
il

GINA GLANTZ- NO. 9795

Age 48
Verified Standard NT
Female
State- CA

LSW 00002303

.5

19

20

23

$ (112.637)

0

(48,198)

(48,198)

$446,792

423,404

580,267

627,048

$2,464.759

2,464,759

2,464,759

2,464,759

$ (112,637)

0

(48,198)

(48,198)

$
533,218

734,572

2,086,807

2,817,349

5
2,464,759

2.464,759

2,464,759

3,239,952

Case 2:10-cv-09198-JVS -RNB Document 346-4 Filed 10/02/12 Page 19 of 19 Page ID
#:15301